How much is 1/10,000 of a degree?

[cftbq]

I had always thought that Blanca Peak was the high point of three counties (Huerfano, Costilla, and Alamosa). But I see that 'Huerfano Co. HP" is listed as a seperate point. Looking at the stats, it also see that it's placed 1/10,000th of a degree N and 1/10,000 of a degree E of the actual summit of Blanca.
Well, I climbed Blanca the other day. And, truth be told, we wandered all over the summit area to take pictures and soak in the view. So, can I also claim credit for the "Huerfano Co. HP," or only Costilla and Alamosa counties??
(BTW, my own on-site readings for lat. and long. differ from the published stats by more than 1/10,000th of a degree, and I've usually found my GPS unit to be pretty accurate in this regard.)

[John Kirk]

The county line is probably 20-30' east of the summit cairn. I went up a different way than from the east the first time I did Blanca (went up more on the west face), so didn't count it. I made sure to follow the ridge up and stay a bit east of the summit cairn the second time. I think the standard route goes over the HP.

[cftbq]

Thanks, John. OK; so this raises an obvious question: Why don't the three county lines all converge on the exact summit? Since these aren't straight lines of longitude or latitude, but appear to follow the natural contours of the mountain, why weren't they simply defined as all running up to the actual summit?

[John Kirk]

I suppose it is up for debate, but the thinking is that the point where the two ridges intersect is the county boundary, which is not the summit of Blanca:

http://cohp.org/co/colorado.html#Huerfano

[Layne Bracy]

Thanks, John. OK; so this raises an obvious question: Why don't the three county lines all converge on the exact summit? Since these aren't straight lines of longitude or latitude, but appear to follow the natural contours of the mountain, why weren't they simply defined as all running up to the actual summit?

According to county officials, and as you see on the map, the county lines are defined as following the ridge lines. As John notes, the county line following the ridge from Lindsey hits the Blanca/Ellingwood ridge a little below the summit. So, if you were to re-define the county lines as meeting on the summit, one of them would have to 'jump' off the ridgeline.

The Huerfano County HP is pretty easy to identify when you're up there. We noticed that we did not incidentally hit it on the way up Blanca and had to hit it on the way down, but it's probably true that some folks cross it by happenstance.

[cftbq]

Well, dang and tarnation! There I was, in my high-altitude euphoria, beliving the simplistic things I had read to the effect that Blanca was three high points in one, and I almost undoubtedly didn't wander far enough off the true summit to hit the Huerfano HP. Now I'm going to have to go back, just for that <sheds crocodile tears>.
Trisha, with her "no repeats 'til I'm done" policy, probably won't want to do it with me. Anyone out there planning a Blanca/Ellingwood (yeah, missed that one too... ) foray for later in the summer and willing to take on one more?

[MikeRodenak]

My understanding is that if you follow the ridge crest directly when ascending or descending the standard route you will cross the highpoint. We counted it when we climbed it for that reason. As John said, the ridge lines are the county border but the summit itself is just to the southwest of the where the ridge lines converge, so I am pretty confident that following the ridge crest will lead you over the county HP. Hope that helps, depending on how you climbed you may have crossed it after all

[cftbq]

OK; <agonizing, agonizing>...
We followed, as best we could, what I think is the standard route up the ridge from the Ellingwood/Blanca saddle. However, we found that the cairned route diverged from the ridge crest to the west (climber's right) 100 vertical feet or so below the summit, then switchbacked sharply just below the summit, so that the final approach seemed to be from the west (Little Bear side). We followed this same route down. Is there another well-worn route off the exact summit, which we missed?

[Layne Bracy]

I think as you near the summit that there are various final approaches.

However, my experience was the same as yours: the route generally follows the crest, but at one point the path of least resistance does lead off the ridge to the west a little. By the time one is led back to the ridge near the summit, the Huerfano County hp has been missed. So, unless one were very meticulously staying on the ridge the entire way, I think most people would not cross the ridge intersection(Huefano hp) accidentally.

I'm also fairly sure from discussions I've had that missing the exact spot doesn't bother some people, and they tick off all 3 hp's just for reaching Blanca's summit. I guess we all draw the line somewhere.

BTW, Blanca is one of two mountains in the US where 3 county hp's can be found. On the other, the true summit also contains 2 hp's, but the 3rd is more out of the way than on Blanca, and a separate trip is generally used to get the other hp.

[cftbq]

I think as you near the summit that there are various final approaches.

However, my experience was the same as yours: the route generally follows the crest, but at one point the path of least resistance does lead off the ridge to the west a little. By the time one is led back to the ridge near the summit, the Huerfano County hp has been missed. So, unless one were very meticulously staying on the ridge the entire way, I think most people would not cross the ridge intersection(Huefano hp) accidentally.

Not that I'm surprised. It's what I get for not doing my homework well enough before hitting the trail. But I certainly appreciate the benefit of your experience and expertise.

I'm also fairly sure from discussions I've had that missing the exact spot doesn't bother some people, and they tick off all 3 hp's just for reaching Blanca's summit. I guess we all draw the line somewhere.

No, for all that it's annoying, I won't fudge reality that far. I have to go back for Ellingwood anyway, so you'll see "Huerfano County HP" checked off on my list after I've actually stood there.

BTW, Blanca is one of two mountains in the US where 3 county hp's can be found. On the other, the true summit also contains 2 hp's, but the 3rd is more out of the way than on Blanca, and a separate trip is generally used to get the other hp.

I didn't know this! What is this other mountain?

[Layne Bracy]

Mt Jefferson, Oregon

Kevin Baker and I also had to make separate return trips to Blanca for the Huerfano hp. I thought it was actually kind of nifty to have a county hp defined by natural features other than a summit! This is the only case I am aware of in the country.

[cftbq]

Kevin Baker and I also had to make separate return trips to Blanca for the Huerfano hp.

Awright! Now I don't feel nearly so dumb!!

[lukePlumley]

When I climbed Blanca last summer, there was an obvious small cairn where the two ridges met forming the third county highpoint. If following the ridge directly, the cairn could not be missed if you were looking for the spot. I would bet it is still there. i might even have a picture of it here somewhere. It really is only 15 steps or so from the true summit. there is a decent chance that if you wandered around on the summit area enough, you probably hit it.

[cftbq]

Thank you, Luke! Please send me that picture, so I can compare it with my own, and my recollections!

[JoeGrim]

To answer the initial question, 1/10,000ths of a degree is:
about 37 feet latitudinally
about 28 feet longitudinally at 40 degrees latitude

An easy way to remember the distance of one degree is that at the equator it is equal to 111 km. One degree is also exactly equal to 60 nautical miles, while a nautical mile is just over 6000 feet. So, one minute is exactly equal to one nautical mile. And accordingly, one second is almost exactly 100 feet.